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Mystic_Merlin
Joined: 15 Oct 2007 Posts: 508 Location: Bangkok
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Posted: Tue Mar 22, 2022 10:01 am Post subject: The Game Doctor CD Thread (CD7, CR523B, CR562J, CR563B) |
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I just got Game Doctor CD7 for the GDSF7. The drive is in a pretty bad shape so it's gonna need a lot of care and fixing before I even get to test it.
In the meantime I've been searching on Tototek/Google for info on it and there's not much about it. I thought it would be nice to centralize all the information on a single thread.
The different models
First of all there are 2 types of CD-ROM available: the caddy one and the tray one.
The caddy one is an early 1x drive based on the CR523B and is compatible with the GDSF3, GDSF6 and GDSF7
The tray version uses a 2x drive, either a CR562 or CR563 and is only compatible with the GDSF7 (and GDSF6?).
All the drives use the MKE or SLCD interface which is a short lived 8bit protocol.
The only info I could find about it is here:
https://www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/~theom/electronics/panasoniccd.html
These MKE drives are pretty rare these days and were used on PC via a Sound Blaster interface. I still have a CR-563-B on my first 486.
The CD7 PCB also has a 34 pin slot connector for a Sony Drive but there's no information about it. A quick Google search led to a Sony CDU-33A, also an 8 Bit CD DRIVE that needed a proprietary ISA card or a Sound Card interface on PC.
If you look at offset &32D8 in the GDSF7 7.11 Bios you will see clear text referencing those 3 drives:
- For Sony
- For 523B Drive
- For 562B Drive
Also a bit further you'll notice:
- File No:
- SONG NO:
I wasn't aware the CD7 can play music but apparently the function is available in the BIOS, probably some CDDA.
Burning CDs
- disc must be a mode 1 ISO9660 disc with 8.3 filenames.
- all roms have to be in the root folder.
- games have to be in GD-Format
- you can also put PCX files in 256x224
Apparently CDR must be burnt at low speed and preferably have a gold bottom layer.
MKE ODE
In an old TTK thread, kyuusaku mentionned that there are very few chances this protocol may ever be reversed engineered and he was most definitely right at the time considering the size of the market.
That is until I realized the 3DO consoles also use the MKE protocol and there are at least 2 ODE available for the FZ-1:
http://3do-mnemo.com/
https://3dodev.com/documentation/ode
These won't be a drop in replacement but we're getting closer, especially if it's open source.
Here I'm attaching a few useful things. Don't hesitate to add some.
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The CD being accessed on a CR523B |
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132.71 KB |
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33.7 KB |
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CD7 PCB - Back Only the DB25 and the 4 pin mini-din PSU ports are populated on this side |
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87.63 KB |
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CD7 PCB - Front S1 is bridged on pin 1&2 S2 is bridged on pin 2&3 Only C2, U4,CON1 and the CON4 are populated on this side |
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98.03 KB |
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17068 Time(s) |
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NorQue
Joined: 08 Jul 2006 Posts: 65
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Posted: Tue Mar 22, 2022 8:48 pm Post subject: |
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I distantly remember seeing some schematics, but the closest I could find is this post. The PCBs used to be available until not too long ago at Tomys colleagues site here and here.
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Mystic_Merlin
Joined: 15 Oct 2007 Posts: 508 Location: Bangkok
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Posted: Wed Mar 23, 2022 8:30 am Post subject: |
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You're talking about the CD Clone made by The Dumper?
Here I attached it but I had to resize the .jpg to fit in the upload size limit.
I just had a look at the GDSF3 and GDS6 bios. Unsurprisingly there's no reference to the CD-ROM in the GDSF3 bios as all the instructions must be in the bios of the parallel adapter. I'll dump this one at some point.
As for the GDSF6, there's only a reference to the CR523B which suggests it would be the only drive compatible with this model.
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cd7cloneB.zip |
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140.71 KB |
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496 Time(s) |
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MottZilla
Joined: 08 Sep 2004 Posts: 765
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Posted: Tue Apr 19, 2022 7:35 pm Post subject: |
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I imagine if it weren't for all the great relatively cheap flash carts someone would have reverse engineered the protocol by now to hooked some other storage device.
I've thought about getting the appropriate drive before and building my own interface. But usually the drives aren't cheap. I imagine it would be possible to using modern devices translate between the MKE/Panasonic interface and something more readily available to read a cd-rom or emulated cd-rom via an ISO.
Maybe there is another reason for why you couldn't hookup a USB optical drive through a device like a FPGA and make it work, but I think the reason we haven't seen it is certainly a lack of motivation. It's been well over a decade since these old Copiers were the go to way to play ROMs on real hardware.
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Mystic_Merlin
Joined: 15 Oct 2007 Posts: 508 Location: Bangkok
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Posted: Mon May 02, 2022 4:55 pm Post subject: |
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Hey MottZilla, nice to see you around
As usual for this type of old gear, the main purpose is to document and keep them running, not so much about a daily usage.
As I mentioned earlier, the MKE protocol has already been reverse engineered since those ODE for the 3DO are commercialized; it wouldn't take much to adapt them for the CD7.
I already spent quite some time on the CR-562J and learnt some interesting things as most of the mechanical parts are identical to the FZ-10 CD drive. If I can salvage the driver board, I hope to revive it.
Just to be sure I got a 2nd FZ-10 for cheap and I brought back a CR-562B I kept in my basement many years ago.
I'll report my findings when I finish this restoration.
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system64
Joined: 17 May 2009 Posts: 118
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Posted: Mon Aug 22, 2022 8:13 pm Post subject: |
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Does anyone know if GDSF3, 6, 7 are compatible with CR-521
and/or CR-522 drives?
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Mystic_Merlin
Joined: 15 Oct 2007 Posts: 508 Location: Bangkok
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Posted: Tue Aug 30, 2022 1:57 pm Post subject: |
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system64 wrote: | Does anyone know if GDSF3, 6, 7 are compatible with CR-521
and/or CR-522 drives? |
They could work as a 523, usually there are minor modifications between those but you might have to use the ROM from a CR-523
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NorQue
Joined: 08 Jul 2006 Posts: 65
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Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 9:57 am Post subject: |
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There's one on Ebay right now CIB for the ridiculously low price of just 1,050.00 CAD/778.21 USD. Just in case someone is feeling generous and wants to help Mystic_Merlins research...
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Mystic_Merlin
Joined: 15 Oct 2007 Posts: 508 Location: Bangkok
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Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 10:50 am Post subject: |
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NorQue wrote: | There's one on Ebay right now CIB for the ridiculously low price of just 1,050.00 CAD/778.21 USD. Just in case someone is feeling generous and wants to help Mystic_Merlins research... |
I'm currently in France for a few days and I also came across a few copier ads on eBay. Prices are really ridiculous compared to Asia.
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borgdude
Joined: 10 Dec 2020 Posts: 16
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Posted: Thu Mar 09, 2023 6:26 pm Post subject: |
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How do you handle hirom games? They don't seem to work. I am batch converting the games with this command. ucon64 -k --nbak --gd3 --idnum=1 "ActRaiser 2 (USA).sfc"
_________________ Looking for a Super Wildcard DX2 |
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system64
Joined: 17 May 2009 Posts: 118
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Posted: Tue Mar 21, 2023 7:20 pm Post subject: |
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I have a problem with my Game Doctor CD7.
I have a disc with 845 files from SF4001 to SF8619. It does load the files with small numbers fine, but files with higher numbers do not load, instead I get the message: Disk Format error!
Does anyone know the limitations of a CD for the Game Doctor?
I know it's limited to 8.3 characters.
Is there a maximum file limit or file per folder limit or total size limit?
I can only load games up to SF8110.
UPDATE:
I've swapped the CD drive and got better results, but still not satisfying.
A shorter Parallel cable helped a bit as well.
In the end I've got it fully working:
I used the cheapest CD-R I had in my collection and burned it at the maximum speed. Game Doctor can read the whole disc filled up with 702 megabytes of data now. incredible!
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borgdude
Joined: 10 Dec 2020 Posts: 16
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Posted: Wed Mar 22, 2023 12:01 am Post subject: |
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system64 wrote: | I have a problem with my Game Doctor CD7.
I have a disc with 845 files from SF4001 to SF8619. It does load the files with small numbers fine, but files with higher numbers do not load, instead I get the message: Disk Format error!
Does anyone know the limitations of a CD for the Game Doctor?
I know it's limited to 8.3 characters.
Is there a maximum file limit or file per folder limit or total size limit?
I can only load games up to SF8110.
UPDATE:
I've swapped the CD drive and got better results, but still not satisfying.
A shorter Parallel cable helped a bit as well.
In the end I've got it fully working:
I used the cheapest CD-R I had in my collection and burned it at the maximum speed. Game Doctor can read the whole disc filled up with 702 megabytes of data now. incredible! |
How did you convert your roms? also, do you know how to get hirom games to work or do they just work for you?
_________________ Looking for a Super Wildcard DX2 |
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NorQue
Joined: 08 Jul 2006 Posts: 65
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Posted: Wed Mar 22, 2023 8:10 am Post subject: |
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Ucon64 converts these. The GDSF7 is a copier from late in the SNES-era and does not have any kind of LoROM/HiROM problems.
Regarding your previous post, I've made the experience that leaving out the -k switch and only using it when needed works much better. GDSF7 rarely needs it, anyways, if at all.
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system64
Joined: 17 May 2009 Posts: 118
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Posted: Fri Aug 18, 2023 10:27 pm Post subject: |
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I've aquired a CR-523B from Creative a few days ago.
I do not have the original enclosure nor the pcb for the CR-523B.
However I have a selfmade pcb with the LS244 chip. This pcb does work fine with my GDSF7 and a CR-562B drive.
I've connected the CR-523B instead of the 562B drive. Unfortunately the GDSF7 does not detect it. There isn't even a message on the screen. It just freezes.
I've tried with a GDSF6, it says linking... but nothing happens.
Same issue with a GDSF3.
Does the CR-523B require the original enclosure from Multi-System Technology with the Kingbyte chipset? https://www.tototek.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?p=11019
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